Post by Andrei Tchentchik on Jan 31, 2020 10:26:58 GMT 2
(.#372).- Gerry Zeitlin. When reality becomes a gateway to the stars.
Gerry Zeitlin. When reality becomes a gateway to the stars.
April 2005.
Our friend Gerry Zeitlin, retired astrophysicist of the Seti project, founder with his companion Malou of the website "Open-Seti / The End of an Enchantment" offered us a new interview quite brief and very clear on what he thinks of the holographic model of the universe.
Without knowing the content of the book and the thesis of David Icke beforehand, he approaches it singularly on certain aspects; namely the "predatory" and illusory face of our world. But if Gerry seems to agree that matter is indeed a kind of illusion, he feels it is somewhat futile and useless to compare our universe to a hologram or an Internet computer network.
It is at most a technological fashion effect that will disappear when holograms and the Internet are outmoded techniques. Gerry, like his principle of "incrementalism", of a difference that he developed in Open Seti to approach extraterrestrial civilizations, urges the reader to go beyond the need to refer to an image, a point of comparison related to our technological evolution. We must go further and visualize our universe with tools and less random concepts, less dependent on a fashion effect. Judge by yourself…
Karma One : What do you think of the holographic model of representation of the universe that comes from the research of David Bohm (the reality is a hologram in 3 dimensions) and Karl Pribram (memory and brain function as a hologram. The memory is not stored in a specific area but is everywhere and nowhere at the same time)?
Gerry Zeitlin : It's not a really useful model. Bohm and Pribram had noted that some aspects of nature - quantum systems and brain functions - shared some of the properties of these holograms, which were at the time a very popular technology. No serious scientist could conclude that these systems are holograms but these two scientists who are however serious people seemed rather inclined to want to become popular and that's what they did.
Karma One : Matter is an illusion full of emptiness. Atoms and quantum particles show us that "solid matter" does not exist in reality. It's just an illusion. What do you think?
Gerry Zeitlin : That's okay, but the "solid matter" as we conceive it can not exist. At the same time, as long as this illusion is perpetuated according to our expectations, why should we complain about it?
Karma One : Yes but many people suffer from the reality. Many people complain about it and consider that something is wrong?
Gerry Zeitlin : When I say "who can complain about it", all I'm saying is that this "illusion" works reliably in such a way that we can entrust it with our lives. For example, if this illusion worked as in a dream in which a thing is a thing at a time and the next moment, it changes in nature and becomes something else when you observe it, then there is something complain and that's what I want to mean.
You can not do anything if you try, for example, to hammer a nail and find that instead of the hammer, you end up holding a noodle in your hands and the nail has turned into a door. entrance to the stars.
AND HOWEVER, we SUFFER from taking this illusion too seriously.
It would have been better if we knew that the hammer is not a hammer and the nail is not a nail and that all the things we are certain of are not certain at all. But in fact, knowing this, we continue to go about our daily tasks as if nothing had happened, to "cut the wood and bring the water home."
Nevertheless, I am not in favor of referring to reality as "holograms". Because the hologram is a typical object of 20th century technology. I saw that David Icke really regarded reality as an Internet network.
You see, this is precisely the NEXT technological step. What will it be about in 10 years? I have a hard time seeing the benefit that can be gained from treating everything this way.
Karma One : Do you believe that reality is the result of a consensus between minds, between the consciences of each individual. Or as Jung claimed, reality is the result of the collective unconscious?
Gerry Zeitlin : There is no way to know if consensus is the cause or the result of how reality manifests itself and whether it really manifests itself in the same way for everyone or if the unconscious collective is really real.
Karma One : Do you believe that we are trapped in our own beliefs, our own perceptions of reality. Some people like Michael Talbot or David Icke think that reality is a kind of perceptual matrix, simply an illusion in 3 dimensions (with the temporal dimension). If we all changed together at the same time the matter of feeling the world, the reality and the very nature of the Matrix would change?
Gerry Zeitlin : I agree with the notion that it's a virtual reality that's happening but it's being addressed by our neuro-sensory system. Therefore, this reality can not easily change without changing the neuro-sensory system in itself. Do we have the ability to change our neuro sensory system? I would bet yes but to some degree. For example, a developing child's neuro-sensory system changes based on genetic guidelines, the influence of the environment, and perhaps the child's innate consciousness. But for most of us, adults, this system is rather difficult to change.
Karma One : Do you think that the "Authorities" or what we may call the future world government as well as religions want to strengthen the power of this Matrix by inculcating us in what we can believe and we can not believe, this that you must love and hate?
Gerry Zeitlin : Yes, through very sophisticated systems that are in place and working.
Karma One : Can we compare this Matrix to the Gnostic perception of the world? Man fell into an imperfect universe, an error created by an Eon, a creature who made a mistake of creation. This world is guarded by the Authorities or the Archons?
Gerry Zeitlin : Wrong Aeons and Archons or Guards leaders manifest themselves in many thought systems. Therefore, there must be an embryo of truth in this story. It is all too obvious that human beings live in an "imperfect universe" when we perceive this universe from the level where we usually feel. However, I believe that given a "higher" level, there must be a purpose to all of this, therefore the system is actually "perfect".
Karma One : Have you seen the movie "The Matrix"? In this film, we are actually batteries, kinds of batteries of energy that just serve to make the system work. Our fear of being disconnected from the Matrix or being abnormal is the best cohesion tool used by Matrix agents to trap us. What do you think of this metaphor?
Gerry Zeitlin : I think it's a very good metaphor. However, I have the intuition that these agents do not realize that they are themselves employed by a higher system.
Karma one
Karma one - © karmapolis - April 2005
Source: http: //www.karmapolis.be
www.elishean.fr/
Copyright les Hathor © Elishean/2009-2015/ Elishean mag
F I N .
Gerry Zeitlin. When reality becomes a gateway to the stars.
April 2005.
Our friend Gerry Zeitlin, retired astrophysicist of the Seti project, founder with his companion Malou of the website "Open-Seti / The End of an Enchantment" offered us a new interview quite brief and very clear on what he thinks of the holographic model of the universe.
Without knowing the content of the book and the thesis of David Icke beforehand, he approaches it singularly on certain aspects; namely the "predatory" and illusory face of our world. But if Gerry seems to agree that matter is indeed a kind of illusion, he feels it is somewhat futile and useless to compare our universe to a hologram or an Internet computer network.
It is at most a technological fashion effect that will disappear when holograms and the Internet are outmoded techniques. Gerry, like his principle of "incrementalism", of a difference that he developed in Open Seti to approach extraterrestrial civilizations, urges the reader to go beyond the need to refer to an image, a point of comparison related to our technological evolution. We must go further and visualize our universe with tools and less random concepts, less dependent on a fashion effect. Judge by yourself…
Karma One : What do you think of the holographic model of representation of the universe that comes from the research of David Bohm (the reality is a hologram in 3 dimensions) and Karl Pribram (memory and brain function as a hologram. The memory is not stored in a specific area but is everywhere and nowhere at the same time)?
Gerry Zeitlin : It's not a really useful model. Bohm and Pribram had noted that some aspects of nature - quantum systems and brain functions - shared some of the properties of these holograms, which were at the time a very popular technology. No serious scientist could conclude that these systems are holograms but these two scientists who are however serious people seemed rather inclined to want to become popular and that's what they did.
Karma One : Matter is an illusion full of emptiness. Atoms and quantum particles show us that "solid matter" does not exist in reality. It's just an illusion. What do you think?
Gerry Zeitlin : That's okay, but the "solid matter" as we conceive it can not exist. At the same time, as long as this illusion is perpetuated according to our expectations, why should we complain about it?
Karma One : Yes but many people suffer from the reality. Many people complain about it and consider that something is wrong?
Gerry Zeitlin : When I say "who can complain about it", all I'm saying is that this "illusion" works reliably in such a way that we can entrust it with our lives. For example, if this illusion worked as in a dream in which a thing is a thing at a time and the next moment, it changes in nature and becomes something else when you observe it, then there is something complain and that's what I want to mean.
You can not do anything if you try, for example, to hammer a nail and find that instead of the hammer, you end up holding a noodle in your hands and the nail has turned into a door. entrance to the stars.
AND HOWEVER, we SUFFER from taking this illusion too seriously.
It would have been better if we knew that the hammer is not a hammer and the nail is not a nail and that all the things we are certain of are not certain at all. But in fact, knowing this, we continue to go about our daily tasks as if nothing had happened, to "cut the wood and bring the water home."
Nevertheless, I am not in favor of referring to reality as "holograms". Because the hologram is a typical object of 20th century technology. I saw that David Icke really regarded reality as an Internet network.
You see, this is precisely the NEXT technological step. What will it be about in 10 years? I have a hard time seeing the benefit that can be gained from treating everything this way.
Karma One : Do you believe that reality is the result of a consensus between minds, between the consciences of each individual. Or as Jung claimed, reality is the result of the collective unconscious?
Gerry Zeitlin : There is no way to know if consensus is the cause or the result of how reality manifests itself and whether it really manifests itself in the same way for everyone or if the unconscious collective is really real.
Karma One : Do you believe that we are trapped in our own beliefs, our own perceptions of reality. Some people like Michael Talbot or David Icke think that reality is a kind of perceptual matrix, simply an illusion in 3 dimensions (with the temporal dimension). If we all changed together at the same time the matter of feeling the world, the reality and the very nature of the Matrix would change?
Gerry Zeitlin : I agree with the notion that it's a virtual reality that's happening but it's being addressed by our neuro-sensory system. Therefore, this reality can not easily change without changing the neuro-sensory system in itself. Do we have the ability to change our neuro sensory system? I would bet yes but to some degree. For example, a developing child's neuro-sensory system changes based on genetic guidelines, the influence of the environment, and perhaps the child's innate consciousness. But for most of us, adults, this system is rather difficult to change.
Karma One : Do you think that the "Authorities" or what we may call the future world government as well as religions want to strengthen the power of this Matrix by inculcating us in what we can believe and we can not believe, this that you must love and hate?
Gerry Zeitlin : Yes, through very sophisticated systems that are in place and working.
Karma One : Can we compare this Matrix to the Gnostic perception of the world? Man fell into an imperfect universe, an error created by an Eon, a creature who made a mistake of creation. This world is guarded by the Authorities or the Archons?
Gerry Zeitlin : Wrong Aeons and Archons or Guards leaders manifest themselves in many thought systems. Therefore, there must be an embryo of truth in this story. It is all too obvious that human beings live in an "imperfect universe" when we perceive this universe from the level where we usually feel. However, I believe that given a "higher" level, there must be a purpose to all of this, therefore the system is actually "perfect".
Karma One : Have you seen the movie "The Matrix"? In this film, we are actually batteries, kinds of batteries of energy that just serve to make the system work. Our fear of being disconnected from the Matrix or being abnormal is the best cohesion tool used by Matrix agents to trap us. What do you think of this metaphor?
Gerry Zeitlin : I think it's a very good metaphor. However, I have the intuition that these agents do not realize that they are themselves employed by a higher system.
Karma one
Karma one - © karmapolis - April 2005
Source: http: //www.karmapolis.be
www.elishean.fr/
Copyright les Hathor © Elishean/2009-2015/ Elishean mag
F I N .
